Even so that's very strange way for a trespassing charge to be carried out if that's how it went down.
Typically when someone refuses to leave, police inform the person that they are being formally trespassed, at which point they have the option to leave voluntarily at which point they are only allowed back at the trespassee's discretion. Not sure how that would work for public places where people have to conduct municipal business.
> When he went a few seconds over his allotted 3 minute time limit, the city ordered Blanchard arrested and transported to the county jail. The city charged Blanchard with trespassing
Even then, hard to tell if this will hold up in court. Town halls should be recorded ("should") and there's inevitable up and downtime for speakers. This is why police have a radar tolerance of 5 mph before trying to write a speeding ticket.
>You can easily go through a couple hundred rounds in one visit to the range.
Range shooting is not what they're trying to legislate though.
Whoever killed that healthcare CEO didn't need a hundred rounds.
This legislation is insanely, horrendously bad and harmful, but "3D printed gun components are useless" isn't a solid argument against it. They're useful enough.
The real arguments, as others said, are:
1. You can achieve much more already without 3D printers
2. The legislation won't achieve its stated objective as any "blueprint detector" DRM will be trivial to circumvent on many levels (hardware, firmware, software)
3. Any semblance of that DRM being required will kill 3D printing as we know it (the text of the law is so broad that merely having a computer without the antigun spyware would be illegal if it means it can drive a 3D printer)
> Range shooting is not what they're trying to legislate though.
It's the thing gun manufacturers are selling to their customer base though. The theory was they were lobbying for this to prevent competition, but it's not good enough to actually compete with them.
> Whoever killed that healthcare CEO didn't need a hundred rounds.
Luigi Mangione didn't have a criminal record. Given his apparent political alignment, he presumably used 3D printed parts for trolling purposes since there was no actual need for him to do so. He could have bought any firearm from any of the places they're ordinarily sold.
>It's the thing gun manufacturers are selling to their customer base though. The theory was they were lobbying for this to prevent competition
Does anyone actually believe this? Is there any funds for this theory?
Seems to be too far fetched to be even worth sitting.
>Luigi Mangione didn't have a criminal record
That really isn't the point (he still doesn't have a criminal record, by the way).
The point was that the stated danger of 3D printed guns is their use by criminals for criminal purposes, not economic competition to established gun manufacturers.
> The point was that the stated danger of 3D printed guns is their use by criminals for criminal purposes, not economic competition to established gun manufacturers.
I guess the counterpoint is that it's not actually useful to criminals either, so there is no incentive for any non-fool to want laws like this and then all incentive arguments are weak because foolishness can be attributed to anyone.
One, you succeed in never being identified or apprehended. Consequently you, rather than the police, have the gun you used, and you can file off the serial number and throw it into the sea or whatever. They don't know who you are so they never come looking for the gun you no longer have and it's just one of millions that were sold to random people that year.
Two, you get caught before you do the murder. Some cop thinks you look too nervous or you get into a car accident on the way there etc. and they find the gun. Having one without a serial number at this point means you're in trouble when you otherwise wouldn't be. It's a disadvantage.
Three, they catch you in the act or figure out who you are because your face got caught on camera somewhere after you took off your mask etc. At this point it's extremely likely you're going to jail. This is even more likely if the weapon is still in your possession because then they can do forensics on it, and it not having a serial number at that point is once again even worse for you. This is apparently the one that actually happened.
Whereas the theory for it allowing you to get caught would have to be something like, they don't know who you are but they have a list of people who bought a gun (which, depending on the state, they might not even have) so they can look on it to find you. But that's like half the US population and doesn't really narrow it down at all.
There is no criminal benefit in doing it so that leaves the remaining options which are either trolling or stupidity.
It comes back the same thing, there is zero evidence that gun manufacturers are lobbying for this while Everytown is very publicly and proudly announcing that they are pushing this exact legislation.
Depends on what the intended use is. 3DP firearms have proliferated internationally and have been used against conventional militaries. Agreed they aren't a replacement, but practical use cases exist.
What I'm saying is that no one is going to build a lower in this manner for a firearm chambered in 7.62 and do anything useful/important with it. Maybe the cartridge size here is a distraction, idk, but this isn't a specification that I would consider common and/or useful for 3D printing a firearm. Even if your nominal intent is just to "finish" a gun with parts you have laying around, it's not going to be something that's consistently reliable.
You call these project[s], which I think is very accurate for the higher power cartridges. You sound like you've seen a lot of the videos of 3D printed firearms, and from what I can tell they cluster around 9mm and 5.56. There's probably multiple reasons for that, one of which is that those round sizes are more widely available and cheaper, while another is that it is going to be easier to do than something with higher power. So to maybe simplify my point, the technical challenges and inherent safety issues on 7.62 are higher. Thus, projects they shall remain.
At this point with a 5,000 round endurance for a plastic AK receiver, I think it's fair to say the 'project' has reached maturity. Especially when this is all completed on entry level printers
The FGC-9 was used extensively in Myanmar for that exact purpose. The rebels would set up ambushes with FGC-9's and recover better firearms for future use
Sure, I can imagine any number of motives and Rube Goldberg mechanisms for procuring a firearm to service that motive. My point is that if someone who is desperate to get a firearm has to 3D print one they’re going to pick a simple pistol lower. Not something for a rifle that fires a higher power cartridge. Most rifles that fire 7.62 are not in the AR format.
So there are people who would have a use for a high powered rifle with limited durability.
> What I'm saying is that no one is going to build a lower in this manner for a firearm chambered in 7.62 and do anything useful/important with it. Maybe the cartridge size here is a distraction, idk, but this isn't a specification that I would consider common and/or useful for 3D printing a firearm.
The fact that no one was caught using such a weapon is irrelevant. You stated that there are people out there who would use it, so your statement that "no one" would want to is untrue.
>You stated that there are people out there who would use it, so your statement that "no one" would want to is untrue.
Huh? There is no evidence that anyone is using a 3D printed 7.62 weapon system to do crimes. Of the existing evidence, criminals overwhelmingly use conventional firearms. I'm not understanding your point. The would-be and successful assassins in the news the last couple years used standard rifles, ranging from 5.56 to .03-06 in caliber. I think you are assuming that criminals are less sensitive to equipment reliability than they actually are.
Let me put it this way. If 3D printed firearms were such a game changer, they would already be using them at scale. They are not, and these laws are part of a fundamental misunderstanding about how firearms function and how 3D printing technology works.
You are arguing against a point I am not defending. I am giving a retort against your statement that you can't imagine why anyone would want a high powered rifle that had a limited reliability window. You admitted that there was a use case for it, and I called that out. That's it. I am not defending nor opposing the ability to 3D print firearms.
I don't think I actually did admit that, and I think the confusion lies in your assumption that someone who wants to do a crime is willing to accept the reliability issues. Perhaps it's worth pointing out that these reliability issues aren't simply lower n-cycles before failure. The weapon could explode on you on the first shot. The probability of this happening is lower for the less powerful cartridges (as I implied earlier but perhaps should've been more explicit). This concept of a "reliability window" is not the right way to think about this. In other words, if someone handed me a 3D printed 7.62 weapon system I would refuse to fire it, and call the person who made it an idiot.
It looks like a Plastikov uses a lot of metal Kalashnikov parts that you'd need to get from a kit or machine yourself or something, so I don't think it's really fair to call that gun a 3D printed gun. It uses printed parts, but the barrel, trigger, etc... aren't printed.
That's the entire point. The only federally regulated part that requires a background check is the receiver, which can be made on entry level printers by virtually anyone that can read.
Protests have been steadily breaking records each time they occur. Protests have been occurring across the country since he took office. This has all been widely publicized
That would require a level of class consciousness that has been violently suppressed for decades. Although maybe there's some hope based on continual record breaking no kings numbers
How could it be that a political system which remained largely structurally unchanged since the freaking 18th century isn't equipped to deal with everything that has been going on in the world since then?
Kinda yeah, much like how Americans are taught that they are a bastion of democracy, yet your convoluted electoral system has led to multiple instances of your president losing the popular vote.
I hate to break this to you, but before the current regime, the Shah was violently enforcing no burka/niqab dress codes. The Shah that was installed by the West
who regurgitates pro-billionaire talking points and thinks the poor just need to lift themselves up by their bootstraps, with some christian persecution complex sprinkled in
Is this a joke? You proclaim your support for a party that proudly posts AI-generated pictures of Obama as a monkey, shits out vitriol-filled messages on literally every holiday, and sends the gestapo to execute American citizens in the streets, and then you demand civil discourse? I'm sorry but that ship has sailed, there is no reason why someone should maintain a civil discussion with you.
I'm so far left my ballot never even included Biden on it but I wanted to say I appreciate that we can talk about things like the Copilot app on HN without it devolving into an excuse for raging political attacks as well.
It's not projecting when it's based directly on your comment history. I used to spout the same things about two decades ago. Hopefully you wise up at some point.
The dismissal is based on decades of lived experience and seeing the same things over and over again. You aren't attempting to engage in good faith and clearly aren't interested in discussing anything more in-depth so my dismissal seems to be well placed.
You voluntarily got involved in a political discussion when you lamely attempted to assert that some things aren't political.
The fact that you have decades of experience on this ball of mud and still espouse the things you do is embarrassing.
You insist that the majority of impoverished are in their situation because of poor life choices while probably also believing that the economy and the levers of political power are rigged (which they are).
You know that the working class has the odds stacked against them while punching down at those less fortunate. Your family may very well suffer from their own bad choices.
I would posit that those choices aren't made in a vacuum. You can preach about personal responsibility while also recognizing systemic and economic injustice against the working class. But you probably won't. You'll keep insisting that lifting yourself up by your bootstraps is a physical possibility. In the end you're just repeating things that help the oligarchy and their strangle hold on our country and the world at large.
Typically when someone refuses to leave, police inform the person that they are being formally trespassed, at which point they have the option to leave voluntarily at which point they are only allowed back at the trespassee's discretion. Not sure how that would work for public places where people have to conduct municipal business.
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